(13 Messages) (Last Post: 12-11 -06 7:15 am)

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First of all, I am grateful for this forum and look forward to this new tool helping me personally, AA groups in MSCA09 and Alcoholics Anonymous as a whole to grow in understanding and effectiveness.

My first thought on this topic was that we need a Class A person to serve as Chair so that, if we ever need a public spokesperson, the question of anonymity would not interfere.  I was certain that we need to maintain this position in order that nobody ever be identified at the public level as a member of AA.

I was also reminded of how impressed I am by the quality of the Class A people we have been priviliged to know.  (I personally had the honor to meet a couple of them and was truly inspired.)

After reading the background material, I believe that it might be time for a change.  It is time to look further into this topic.  3 strong reasons why I believe it is time to consider this issue:  

1) The important point included in the proposal.  The person who made the proposal states: "... whether or not we have, or are able to obtain the services of our BEST QUALIFIED candidates."

2) The desire of AA Co-founder Bill W. who said, "We should also set aside the General Service Board tradition which still precludes A.A. (class B) trustees from holding its chief official posts."  This sentiment is further articulated by one of our greatest non-alcoholic servants in the statement, "It has also been determined that Chairperson Dr. Jack Norris recommended that the GSB bylaws continue to make the board chairmanship open to both A & B Trustees."

3) The reality of what is going on world-wide within A.A.  Specifically, the email responses indicating that, "14 of the 20 responding (GSO's) have a Class B Chairperson of the board, or Class B's are eligible and have served in the past.

Having stated that, I must also state that I love the idea of finding out what our past Chairs believe, being as how they have had the experience of serving in that capacity. 

 I also think we should give careful consideration to the idea of requiring a non-alcoholic Vice Chair if we do decide to allow an alcoholic to serve as Chair.
(Message ID 1.012)   ( Date 7-6 -06 )
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In posting #1.010 the writer demonstrates a thorough knowledge of the process for selection and the history of Class A and Class B Trustees.  However, the posting puts forth some information which is factual, but should be elaborated upon – so I’ll take this time to do that.   

  ·        “..alcoholics effectively control the board and have voted consistently to have a Class A as the chair for over 50 years” is a true statement, but should further state that the Trustees’ Nominating Committee has never nominated a Class B Trustee for that position, given the several advisory actions out of the General Service Conference directing that we continue to consider only Class A Trustees for the position.  That is what this consideration is about – asking the General Service Conference to recommend that the Trustees’ Nominating Committee consider, (emphasis on consider) Class B Trustees along with Class A Trustees for the position of Chairperson of the General Service Board.

·        The statement that “the selection process for a Class A is much more rigorous than a Class B”, is an opinion.  The selection process for Class B Trustees and Class A Trustees is different, not necessarily more rigorous for one than the other.  The selection process for that class of Trustees known as General Service Trustees, (Class B) is probably, (an opinion) as rigorous as any Trustee selection process.

·        To say a Class B can represent us just as well is to denigrate the contributions of every Class A who has ever served”.  How does the consideration of a Class B Trustee for the position of Chairperson of the General Service Board detract in any way from the great debt of gratitude that Alcoholics Anonymous owes to our friends who served us as Class A Trustees?  I see no link between the consideration of Class B Trustees on the one hand, and the appreciation the Fellowship has for those Class A Trustees who have served us in the past, and may continue to serve us in the future.  Where the writer of posting #10 states that the consideration of Class B Trustees for the position of Chair denigrates the contributions of the Class A Trustees in their eyes, it most certainly does not do so for the writer of this post. Every post that speaks against the consideration of Class B Trustees for the position of Chairperson seems to indicate that this is a “slap in the face” to those non-alcoholics who have served us since the beginning.  I cannot see the correlation between this consideration and the idea that it denigrates the contributions of the non-alcoholics who have served Alcoholics Anonymous. 

·        Class A Trustees have been invaluable in the founding, survival and expansion of our Fellowship is another opinion put forth by the writer of posting #1.010 – an opinion that I share with the poster.  However, I would expand on that opinion by stating further that the Class B Trustees have provided at least as much value to the founding, survival and expansion of our Fellowship.  We ask a great deal of all our Trustees, Class A and Class B.  The class of the trustee does not seem to determine the level of commitment we require, nor the performance of the trustee.  As a Fellowship, we are truly blessed by the commitment and performance of all our Trustee members of the General Service Board, Class A and Class B. 

·        What expresses our spiritual program more than choosing a non-alcoholic to chair our board based on their faith in OUR program”?   How about expressing our spiritual program by including in the selection process ALL those who are qualified to perform that service and letting God express himself in our Group Conscience. 

(Message ID 1.011)   ( Date 6-28-06 )

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There is nothing that prevents "us" from selecting a class B to chair the GSB. Since there are 14 class B's and 7 class A's, alcoholics effectively control the board and have voted consistently to have a class A as the chair for over 50 years. Our fellowship through general service conference has endorsed the wisdom of this through conference advisories through the years.

The selection process for a class A is much more rigorous than class B, we choose a class A based on three criteria: their professional qualifications as leaders in their field, the fact that they are not alcoholics and they must have Profound Faith in the program of Alcoholics Anonymous (S60-61). They get nothing for helping us yet their love for OUR program shines thru in every thing they do. I can not think of one past or present Class A that was not the best person for the job. Class A's have been invaluable in the founding, survival and the expansion of our fellowship, let me repeat that: invaluable in the founding, survival and the expansion of our fellowship. There will always be more potential class A's then class B's just by virtue of the fact that there more non-alcoholic professionals than alcoholics.

To say a class B can represent us just as well is to denigrate the contributions of every class A who has ever served. To say we are mature enough to run our fellowship misses the whole point of the service structure, we do run it and have since Bill and Bob turned it over to us in 1950. What expresses our spiritual program more than choosing a non-alcoholic to chair our board based on their faith in OUR program? 

By the way, yes, our first chairman was an alcoholic.  He drank and resigned in 1939.
(Message ID 1.010)   ( Date 6-28-06 )
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In regards to the current Forum topic, I can only speak from experience, strength and hope as past CPC Chair and PI Chair for MSCA 09.  Our Class "A" Trustees as Chairman/Chairwoman of the Board are always available with suggestions through their own experiences.  They are loving, humble people who do not have to be a Chairperson to remain sober for they are nonalcoholic.  As an Alcoholic in recovery, I have to be of service to stay sober and thanks to our Class "A" Chairperson(s) have been able to call, write or ask questions as it happened to pertain to the Committee on which I was serving.  After all we have 14 Class "B" Trustees and 7 Class "A" Trustees.  All you have to do is read our history on page 208 “Alcoholics Anonymous Comes of Age,”  and you would soon realize how invaluable, our Class "A" Trustees are. 
(Message ID 1.008)   ( Date 6-22-06 )
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I see a statement in one of the postings that says, "...if it is not broke lets not try to fix it".  How do we know that it is not broke?   We have never tried it any other way.  Herbert Spencer's quote in Appendix II of the Big Book comes to mind - "There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation."  In the same appendix, there is also a line that reads, "Willingness, honesty and open mindedness are the essentials of recovery.  But these are indispensable".  In looking at this topic, I think these are more indispensible than ever.  This is one of those things that A.A. really needs to take an inventory on.  Our book, "Alcoholics Anonymous Comes of Age" - is this  just a quaint book title, or is it a statement of fact?
(Message ID 1.009)   ( Date 6-21-06 )
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While I am not an attorney, I have heard about  ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) issues.  I don't know if alcoholism falls under the category of the ADA in New York , but it seems to me that we should have some (our) attorneys address the issue of discrimination as it might apply to this discussion.   If we choose not to allow a recovering alcoholic to serve as Chair of the General Service Board, what about people with other mental disorders or diseases besides alcoholism.
(Message ID 1.007)  (Date 6-20-06 )

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We are how old now as AAs(collectively)?  Are we not yet prepared to govern our own fellowship? Or do we need a non-alcohlic holding our hand forever?
We are old enough, and experienced enough, and trust God enough, to govern ourselves
(Message ID 1.006)  (Date 6-19-06 )
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First I would like to say that the class A trustees have done an outstanding job and Ii feel it is vitally important to include non-alcoholics in our service structure because of what they bring in terms of their experiences in life and career. I am humbled by the fact that anyone could give so much when they are not doing it to save their own life!
Having said that, I agree that Tradition 2 and Concept 9 direct us to select the best possible person for the job, amateur or boozer. Because of the need to have a public face for AA, perhaps we could direct that either the chair or the vice-chair be a class A trustee. Thanks for the opportunity to share.
(Message ID 1.005)  (Date 6-19-06 )
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I believe that past Class B Trustees should be considered for inclusion in the list of nominees for election as Chairperson of the General Service Board.  This belief comes to me from several areas:  
(1) the quality of leaders (recovering alcoholics) with which it has been my great privilege to serve throughout Alcoholics Anonymous, provides me with at least the same level of confidence I have found in the non-alcoholic trusted servants who give of their time and resources to serve Alcoholics Anonymous;
(2) Concept 9 which states, in part that “Good service leaders, together with sound and appropriate methods of choosing them, are at all levels indispensable for our future functioning and safety”.   The concept states at ALL levels and does not limit this leadership to all levels, except the level of Chairperson of the General Service Board.  I believe that A.A. deserves the best possible leadership, and this Concept directs us to seek exactly that.  Is it a truly “sound and appropriate method of selecting” our leaders where every member of A.A. is excluded.  
(3) Tradition 2, which directs us to seek God’s will for us in the group conscience.  Is it  a truly informed group conscience, when, by custom, we exclude A.A.’s entire membership from serving in the capacity of Chairperson of the General Service Board?  I don’t believe it is.  I hear so many of the A.A. members who are opposed to this saying that this is egotistical on the part of us alcoholics, to even think that one of us could serve A.A. in the position of Chairperson of the General Service Board – I don’t buy that.  Some of the most gifted and humble servants I have ever met anywhere have served us as Class B Trustees.  I believe that they would serve A.A. well.
(4) The society, Alcoholics Anonymous, has never made any progress by sitting still.  We have tried new things - failed sometimes, succeeded sometimes – but we have tried.  I believe that it is time to try this.
(5) As stated in the background material, several other General Service structures throughout the world already have alcoholics serving as Chairperson of their General Service Boards, (some exclusively).  Is it time we caught up with them?
(Message ID 1.003),  (Date 6-18-06 ).
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I am grateful that we have this forum to discuss this very important topic for the fellowship. It is important to know first off that this proposal came from Class B Trustee not from a Class A . Also the background material that states on whether other countries use Class B as Chairperson of the Board , the number is useful however the whys and why nots for those situations and how these other countries feel about this question is important. More background on this background might be helpful. The ratio is also important. Last but not least lets see how Past chairpersons like Jim Estelle, Gary Glynn and Elaine McDowell feel about this topic? In closing if it is not broke lets not try to fix it. This tradition has worked since 1950, I see no need to consider changing it at this time. Obviously my feelings are subject to change, and I would again thank the Committee for their hard work on this forum.
(Message ID  1.004), (Date 6-17-06 )
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Class B Trustees have developed a level of loyalty and are truly trusted servants and highly respected by the fellowship. I believe (My opinion) the risk for failure to perform or create embarrassment to the fellowship exists equally for both Class A & B Trustees. Class A's can enter recovery as well as Class B's relapsing. Emphasis must be placed upon the basic personal recovering alcoholic experiences known only by the Class B's. Could this experience at the level of the Chairperson be of value to the fellowship? My answer is Yes, for the obvious reason that more is better.
(Message id 1.001)   (Date 6-17-06 )